PDA

View Full Version : [Discussion] Remote PC control



Wingzero01w
05-20-2008, 06:19 PM
Concept-

You have a nice powerful computer in front of you, and you also have a robot that needs computing but doesn't have the space for the electronics- now how would you remotely control a robot using a pc (and have it do the processing for the robot there) via wifi/zig/bluetooth/other?

Well this was an idea i was wondering about if it were possible, to make a small robot... but have its controller be a remote pc and transmit data to it with a link.

I don't know if it was already discussed, but to me this seemed like an interesting way to control a robot and was wondering if anybody has some input on this.

Droid Works
05-20-2008, 06:27 PM
Here is a better solution THIS (http://www.logicsupply.com/products/artigo) is what I am using on my current robotics project. Very tiny and will fit in just about any bot. Why connect a bot to a PC when the bot can be a PC?

Wingzero01w
05-20-2008, 06:41 PM
I was thinking the remote PC as just another option, that might be cheaper (no clue if it is) and even more processing power, it was just a thought. And actually my idea was have a bigger robot control a smaller robot with one of those pico pc's... just dont know the way to do it with hardware/software.

Droid Works
05-20-2008, 07:29 PM
The pico PC I have is 1gig processor 1gig ram 80gig hdd. So it is more than enough power for any bot. But you can get them with 2gig processors and 2gig of ram and 120gig hdd if you need even more power.

LinuxGuy
05-20-2008, 07:47 PM
Concept-

You have a nice powerful computer in front of you, and you also have a robot that needs computing but doesn't have the space for the electronics- now how would you remotely control a robot using a pc (and have it do the processing for the robot there) via wifi/zig/bluetooth/other?
You could put a Serializer with the Bluetooth interface on the robot and control it from any PC using any OS and any language. The Serializer accepts ASCII text commands to do I/O and already has facility for different interfaces (RS-232, USB, Bluetooth, Zigbee).

This method is also supported by Microsoft Robotics Studio if you want to go that route. I am really tempted to get a Serializer for W.A.L.T.E.R. - it will work with Hammer because it accepts TTL serial out of the box. It just needs the voltage levels translated between 3.3V and 5V.

8-Dale

Wingzero01w
05-20-2008, 07:53 PM
Thanks robotguy,

So basically this serializer can control the servos on my robot and have a remote PC be the "brain"? That would be perfect for my project!

LinuxGuy
05-20-2008, 08:05 PM
So basically this serializer can control the servos on my robot and have a remote PC be the "brain"? That would be perfect for my project!
Yes, that's how it works. The Serializer operates from text commands you send it over any supported interface, including Bluetooth.

8-Dale

Adrenalynn
05-20-2008, 08:19 PM
The pico PC I have is 1gig processor 1gig ram 80gig hdd. So it is more than enough power for any bot. But you can get them with 2gig processors and 2gig of ram and 120gig hdd if you need even more power.

"more than enough"

You mean like 640KB of RAM, right?

Dangerous statement. Can your 1ghz pico do reliable face and speaker-independant voice recognition? Mine can't. How many billion nodes can you run on it for AI?

A single machine will never equal a farm full of computing. By definition. 2 >1, 2000 >1, 2000000000 >1.

Droid Works
05-20-2008, 08:23 PM
"more than enough"

You mean like 640KB of RAM, right?

Dangerous statement. Can your 1ghz pico do reliable face and speaker-independant voice recognition? Mine can't. How many billion nodes can you run on it for AI?

A single machine will never equal a farm full of computing. By definition. 2 >1, 2000 >1, 2000000000 >1.
1gig processor 1 gig ddr2 ram 80gig hdd

Mine works great I have ultra hal and roborealm and a bunch of custom vb programs running on it and it works great.

Droid Works
05-20-2008, 08:26 PM
here is the link of the one I have.
http://www.logicsupply.com/products/artigo

Wingzero01w
05-20-2008, 08:51 PM
Whats the dimensions of the serializer from robotics connection?

Adrenalynn
05-20-2008, 09:33 PM
Alas, it can't do reliable face recognition. You can't have it call a few hundred people by name. Because at this point, the projects we're working on for the US Government with hundreds of processors can't do it either. My 24 machine, 96 core 256Ghz Xeon farm, on the other hand, would have a much better shot at it than any 1Ghz stripped-core C3.

HAL isn't close to speaker-independant full stream voice recognition. At the moment that really starts to get reliable at around 16Ghz with multiple channels to RAM and a RAID.

Again, I like the PicoITX, and I use it. I even like this little embedded Geode GX1 here. But the fact is that neither of them have "enough" processing power for hard-core next-gen robotics.

Wingzero01w
05-20-2008, 09:46 PM
Well... you would need alot of high speed serializers for all that processing power, unless you put all those computers on the robot. Though, everyday technology keeps on shrinking in size, so i wouldn't be suprised if we see quad cores on pico itx in the next year or two.

Adrenalynn
05-20-2008, 10:35 PM
>> you would need alot of high speed serializers for all that processing power

Nope. The data going to the serializers is already pre-digested. The PCs are crunching the numbers.

lnxfergy
05-20-2008, 10:42 PM
This is a topic I've been doing some work on for a while. My current series of bots (I posted about Xr-B3 about a week ago) uses Xbee wireless modules to establish a serial connection with my computer. The computer then has control software that starts, stops, and switches behaviors which reside on the AVR inside the robot. The robot can then send back information to the console.

I'm primarily using this to have multiple different tasks on board the robot, and to get debugging data back out. The robot is still autonomous and can operate outside of the range of the Xbee (I have a start button which starts a default behavior). Of course, this is a small indoor robot, so range is not an issue. The Xbee modules are rated to 100ft, I have found that with my laptop residing on the second floor of my house, I still get debug data back to the laptop when running the robot in the basement arena (the module also reports very little loss in signal strength, compared to sitting side by side on my desk). I am currently debating writing code to get my little bot connected to Python Robotics (pyro) which would allow me to do basically what you are talking about.

Of course, the whole caveat a wireless tether from the bot to the brain, is that you need mega-bandwidth if you want to transmit good video for visual routines, otherwise you need to do some camera processing onboard the bot. Thus, a simple serial port connection won't do for more advanced bots. In my experience with AIBO robots, it takes a lot of bandwidth to get high-quality, high-frame-rate video back to the PC, a an 11MBps wifi connection probably won't suffice. And of course, you have to worry about range issues, and saturation from too many bots, people, or netflix downloads going on in your network...

-Fergs

Adrenalynn
05-20-2008, 10:47 PM
11mbit/sec = 802.11b, really old "b". g, or mimo, or pre-n are gonna get you something like 10+ times that bandwidth.

I have a home-built wireless serial solution that will do 2400bps down to the grocery store and back. Just under a mile...

That said, I'm still fond of moving the processing power off to the 'bot. Cheap and easy.

LinuxGuy
05-20-2008, 10:56 PM
That said, I'm still fond of moving the processing power off to the 'bot. Cheap and easy.
All processing for my robots will be on the robot, not remote. :happy: Only debugging data and over ride control will be remoted. Video will be transmitted via WiFi G. Additional processors will be added for specific tasks as required.

8-Dale

Tagnard
05-26-2008, 09:28 AM
If you need something small but not so fast i suggest an Foxboard

Sigma X
03-10-2010, 10:59 PM
I know that this forum is old but I gotta ask does any know what programs are needed to interface ultra hal and roborealm

DannyDeth
03-15-2010, 09:58 AM
You could buy a trancsiever IC ( some are like US $5 ) and interface it with some elctronics to your robot and your computer. It isn't hard, but you will need to microcontrollers instead of only one ( one for the robot, one for the compuyter )

Sigma X
03-16-2010, 01:14 AM
I was hoping for a pc based robot but it's looking that the robor will have to be built that way
I've searched the entire net for 6 months and no luck

ArduTank
07-09-2012, 02:45 PM
I use a program written in Python to control my Arduino based robot with the joystick i have hooked up to my computer.

ArduTank
11-23-2012, 01:37 PM
Another way is to hook up a cheap SBC (Raspberry Pi, etc.) and use Remote Desktop on Linux over Wifi, which can handle webcam feeds and control the bot over the same connection