Page 1 of 4 1234 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 35

Thread: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

  1. mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    Hello,

    This morning I was looking into maybe getting a duo cor 2 mini-itx system as the brains for my humanoid Robot project, when I came across some release stuff on the new quad cor processors and was wondering if there is all the much difference between them and if anyone knows if there is a mini-itx motherboard that can handle a quad cor processor.

    Asbrandsson

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    3,198
    Images
    952
    Rep Power
    138

    Re: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    How do you plan on powering your humanoid?

    The reason I ask, is because weight is usually something you want to keep down as much as possible on a humanoid, and any sort of intel based solution is going to be a major power draw. Intel CPU's draw anywhere from 60-150w depending on model, where the VIA solutions (C7 etc) are usually around 10-25w. It would take a considerable battery to power an intel based solution, and I'm not sure you would see a ton of benefit from that much processing power on a small robot.

  3. Re: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    Hello,

    I have not really put a whole lot of thought into the power portion yet. The OQO 1+ I bought for the project is a good computer, but it does not have a lot of processing power in it, but it is small and I could strip it down to just the board and harddrive and it would be perfect in form.

    However, with just the processing power in mind - if I could construct a brain that has the power of four processors or even two processors in it and get it into a small form factor I would just make the Robot bigger. As then it could process visual images at a good rate and process dynamic movement without having a meltdown.

    I guess I would also use some kind of li-pol batteries to power the thing - but as you say the power draw will still be considerable.

    Asbrandsson OR

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    3,198
    Images
    952
    Rep Power
    138

    Re: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    I'm a big fan of the pico-itx formfactor. There is currently only 1 model out, but it's a great board and packs a lot of power for how small it is, along with very low power consumption ( <15w total). 1ghz VIA C7 cpu w/ 1 gig ddr2-667

    Nice write up of it here: http://www.mini-itx.com/reviews/pico-itx/

  5. #5

    Re: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    Yup a better brain is, well, a better brain.
    It might be more cost-effective to simply have a desktop linked via wireless. Kind of separating the brain from the body, except for what the body needs to know. Between WiFi, Bluetooth, 418/434 Mhz, and 2.4 Ghz there are plenty of 'simultaneous' channels. This also removes power consumption, weight, and limited processing power from the bot, enabling a desktop or laptop's power to be used by an autonomous device. Think of a "radio-wave spinal column".
    Small microcontrollers used by modules can help standardize connections and provide limited distributed processing.

    I see it like this: what board will provide the most complete access to a remote PC? Anything more is just ... more. Not necessarily better. It sure can't beat a desktop's specs.

    Would I take an Itx board?... in a clockcycle. Such is a meat-based analog existance.

  6. Re: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    Hello,

    Although I like remote access- I would like to create a Robot that is autonomous and vision based. I think for something like a Robonova the Pico-itx form factor fits into the body, but it means that it would not be able to think fast enough to make real time behaviours with any amount of speed.

    I have also thought about trying to break the different aspects of the robot up and embedd them. This is how I-droid is set up and it works fairly well and it is easy to upgrade one part of it without upgrading everything, and the power consumption is low.

    Asbrandsson

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Portland, OR
    Posts
    3,198
    Images
    952
    Rep Power
    138

    Re: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    Coming from someone who just implemented a pico-itx solution into a mobile robot, I can tell you that trying to fit it into a Robonova sized robot (especially a biped) along with a battery source, isn't realistic. You're looking at major weight, size and balance issues.

    In fact, at this point in technology, any small biped that is going to be vision based would be best implemented by using a wireless link and offloading the processing to a PC- like what kdwyer suggested. It would still be autonomous, and it could certainly be vision based... it would just have to be within a specific range of a host PC. Realistically, this is your best chance to implement something like that though. Robots like the robonova, or even the Kondo series, simply don't have the payload capacity and space for even a pico-itx solution onboard.

  8. Re: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    Hello,

    I velrcoed a OQO 1+ to the front of the Robonova I have and velcroed a Logitech pro 5000 webcam in place of his head and a 4 way usb splinter to the front of his body. To try it out and it seemed to work fine. The only problem that I ran into is that the cords for the camera and the usb to com port to Robonova line in are all pretty bulky. I can get the Robonova to walk and sit and stand in the configuration. It is not all that secure so I was not exactly getting it to do flips.

    Now that I did that I have been thinking about putting a bigger proto-type together that uses the HSR 5990TG servos for the legs and uses the double knees. I bought the double knees from Bauer Independent but am just waiting for them to show up before I will have a really good idea of how useful the new configuration will be, but there are some videos of Mark getting a Robonova to jump with the HSR-8498HB servos so I am sure with an upgrade they will operate all the better. To give the robot the ability to take more weight. Plus it will have to have two gyros and a tilt sensor to keep it balanced. The I-droid head is about 4" wide so I could make some kind body that is up to 8" wide and it would still be proportionate to the head. Then there is three basic layers to the body.

    1) the PC layer (on the front)

    2) the servo/microcontroller/ head guts

    3) and the battery layer on the back.

    I am not sure how long to make the body maybe 10", but I am thinking about making hips which means that the bottom where the legs go is something in the range of 4" to 5" long basically three servos wide.

    However, with this configuration there should be plenty of room for some kind of motherboard and sufficient batteries to keep it going for some time. There are already mini-itx duo core 2 boards that will fit in the space, as well as some kind of flash drive or 2.5" drive, although I am not sure how well a regular hard drive would stand up to the rigors of slips and trips. I am sure it will have to be shock mounted at the very least.

    Asbrandsson

  9. #9

    Re: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    Forgive me for being repetitively redundant, but I can't shake the feeling that this is growing in complexity.
    First, 'autonomous' ain't what it used to be. The Mars rovers aren't even 100% 'autonomous'. I'm willing to bet one of Tyberias' vital organs that a high-speed wireless solution would cost alot less than a full brain installation (and all that it implies). And face it, how often have you run your bot and left the area? You're always there, and you are probably within a yard of a computer. Yes, true 'autonomy' isn't much fun... you want to see the data the bot is experiencing, you want to interact with it or the data when something interesting (dangerous?) is happening.
    Second, the bot power you seek already exists, just not in a form factor that is familiar. A wireless backplane is every bit as real (pun intended) as a wired one. If we just 'remotely mount' the brain, it is still very much an 'installed component'.

    Geez, I think I just talked myself into upgrading my bots... damn.

    The applause from me for a successful effort, or even a noble failure, will be thunderous and sincere.

  10. Re: mini-itx w/ intel duo quad

    Hello,

    I think that if you have the choice between a remote mounted more powerful brain or a bot mounted less powerful one then it is a no brainer. However, I would like something that is for the most part autonomous. Things like the Mars Rover more or less run by remote control and have some programs built in, but are not all that more complicated then an RC car.

    One of the things that I like about bots like the ER-1 is that they can be programed to have some personality and routines that even though they are behavior based and have no real degree of intelligence behind them, the robot does have some autonomy and you can for security applications leave the robot more or less to its own devices.

    Asbrandsson

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •